Hey Bro Jo,
First of all, you have been a big help to me in the past. I thank you so much for all your advice. I've only written to you once, but I feel its time to get some help from you again...
So, the perplexing predicament...
There is this girl, surprise right? And I've been flirting with her alot. Nothing too serious just kind of like higher level innocent kind of flirting. Nothing bad, just yeah. But anyway. So the problem comes in with the fact that, 1.) She is a non-member, 2.) She has a boy friend, and 3.) I really like her. (only a problem because of the first 2).
So while I've been flirting with her I've known about her boy friend. We've even met a couple of times before me and this girl started flirting. So while I've been flirting with this girl I've felt horrible, because I feel like a woman stealing butt head... I mean, if they were members of the church I would feel differently, but since they aren't I find it different.
Now, the girl goes to Wednesday night activities, and she is familiar with our standards, her grandpa is even a bishop! So she knows about all the dating rules.
Now where the subject of the e-mail comes in. She is flirting back! So that makes me feel even worse! Because that means my flirting is working! And now I really feel like a woman stealing butt head. I don't really know how to explain it. I'm sure you know what I'm talking about.
Just to fill you in we are both proper dating age, so its all good.
Thank you so much for all your help in the past and the future!
Signed,
Back for more.
Dear Back,
First of all, women are not possessions, at least not where you live, so you can't steal her.
Secondly, if I understand you correctly you're Casual Group Dating age, so she shouldn't have a Boyfriend anyway . . .
So I say: Flirt Away!
Heck, ask her out, too.
The only way what you're doing would be wrong is if she's the love interest of a friend or brother OR if what you're doing was inappropriate or unwelcome . . . And that doesn't seem to be the case, so as Sister Jo would say "all's fair in love and war!"
Now, if I put my Good Guy hat on I'll tell you that you should talk to each of them. I'd tell her "hey, I really like you, but I feel like a jerk hitting on another guy's girlfriend" and I'd say to him "hey, I need to let you know that I like _____; I think she likes me too and I'm going to ask her on a date; I'm telling you because I thought you should hear it from me".
With her you'll at least know where you stand; he'll probably be angry, even if you explain Casual Group Dating and that you're not looking for a Girlfriend (wouldn't you be angry, too?), but at least if you're honest about it he'll respect you on some level.
Good luck!
Keep me posted on how it goes,
- Bro Jo
[Readers: Part two will be posted later this week. - Bro Jo]
I think it's entirely inappropriate to ask out a girl with a boyfriend. Whether or not you agree with the fact that she has a boyfriend, she has chosen to make herself unavailable.
ReplyDeleteTo ask her out is a complete disregard of our social rules and could get you a punch in the face from her boyfriend.
The only rules are "All's fair in love and war", "She ain't taken until there's a ring on her finger" and "thou shalt not covet another man's wife".
ReplyDeleteAny guy who punches another guy in the face because he asked out his "girlfriend" is an idiot. If she's loyal she'll say "no"; if she says "yes" then guess what? She's moved on, lover boy.
Stop thinking of girls as possessions. It's pathetic.
- Bro Jo
Stop making assumptions. I'm a girl.
ReplyDeleteAnd I don't think of girls as possessions, but if a guy who knew I had a boyfriend openly asked me out, I would have a huge problem with that. It has nothing to do with being a possession, but with commitment. I don't think boyfriends are a great idea in high school, but committing to someone is exactly what steady dating is and it would be condescending, rude, and utterly inappropriate to ask someone out who is committed to someone else.
As a girl, I would never date a guy who would openly ask me out when I had a boyfriend because it shows a complete disregard for the choice I made.
I didn't assume anything. (Go back and read my response.)
ReplyDeleteIf you want me to know you're a girl, just say so. (Although even then I may not believe it - I get a scary amount of email from guys pretending to be girls . . . I think some of them are hoping I'll convince girls of . . . I don't know . . . something.)
Either way it doesn't change what I wrote.
IF you have a boyfriend and IF another guy asks you out and IF you choose to have a problem with that, well then, that's YOUR problem.
And I have a question (not so much for you to answer, but to ponder): what exactly IS the commitment that two people make to each other in High School? Just exactly what does being a "girlfriend" mean?
That you can't date anyone else? That you can't talk to anyone else? That you can't flirt with anyone else?
If your lab partner is a boy, will your little boyfriend freak out? What if the lab partner has to come over several evenings to work on the assignment? Will fraidy-boy get nervous and jealous? Should he?
Sounds like possession to me.
And it also sounds like you think girlfriends SHOULD be possessed AND that everyone in the world is supposed to know about your . . . "commitment".
If a guy comes up and asks you on a DATE (which, I have found, is something that most High School "boyfriends" never take their "girlfriends" on - steady "dating" my eye!), it's not rude, condescending OR inappropriate.
It's flattering and shows a remarkable level of courage.
Even if he knows you have a "boyfriend" (and he might not), he might just be a nice guy that likes you. Maybe he thinks that you're worth the risk to his pride and face.
If you don't get that, then you don't deserve a boyfriend OR a date.
Instead of being indignant, perhaps you should try being grateful and understanding.
- Bro Jo
Even chivalry towards a girl with a steady boyfriend may cause her to cheat on him and thus she could destroy her relationship. Whether you open doors for her, escort her to class, buy her lunch, drinks, offer your coat, etc. But then most high school girlfriends won't take their boyfriends steady dating. When they interact with other guys, that leads to them being disrespectful to their boyfriends especially when these other guys want to date them.
ReplyDeleteAnother thing, is that I know there are Christian boyfriends who are very possessive over Christian girlfriends, especially when they see their Christian girlfriends interacting with non-believers, like atheists and agnostics for example, thinking that these non-believing guys are sinful and will steal them away. It just shows that Christian guys are self-righteous and prejudiced towards others especially when other guys that don't share their beliefs interact with their girlfriends or wives even when it is innocent.
Sounds like you're hurting, bro. Takes a certain amount of pain to see reality that clouded.
ReplyDeleteIt gets better.
I promise.
Hang in there.
- Bro Jo